Better Call Saulproducer breaks down Gene's 'dangerous' move in 'Nippy'

“With that thrill comes a kind of invigoration and enlivening,” says executive producer Alison Tatlock.

Warning: This story contains plot details from Monday’s episode ofBetter Call Saul, titled “Nippy.”

The final minutes skipped ahead to Saul (Bob Odenkirk) in full, bleak, amoral glory.

And he was also suddenly feeling like his old self.

He began by underhandedly befriending Jeff’s mother, Marion (hello,Carol Burnett!

), with a lost-dog gambit.

with a certain sugary treat while Jeff ran through the store after hours and strategically grabbed merchandise.

ENTERTAINMENT WEEKLY: Last week, the show took viewers right from a devastated Jimmy to a godless Saul.

This week, it surprised by delving solely into Gene, where there’s a lot of unfinished business.

ALISON TATLOCK:Well, [laughs] that is a tough question to answer right now.

So just when fans think they have their footing, should they stay on guard?

Well, that is certainly true of this episode.

Even though some could argue it was the wrong time.

To us, it felt like it was the right time.

I hope it was.

This is a different Gene than shown before; he’s been so meek and shut down.

While he’s doing it to neutralize a threat here, how dangerous is this game for him?

I think it is dangerous for him.

It’s dangerous, and perhaps also a little bit thrilling.

And the more threatening tough side of Saul comes back as well.

This was a complicated episode.

There were so many different elements.

It was a crazy puzzle.

It was a puzzle within a puzzle.

There’s one other thing worth mentioning, which is that we did not have a department store.

Every single item was created or purchased and brought in.

So it wasquitea feat.

And as far as I can tell, you would never know.

It looks absolutely like a real living, breathing department store when you see it on the screen.

Don did have a work conflict.

I’m not at liberty to confirm the job that you mentioned.

Don is more imposing and creepy in the role when he’s confronting Gene at the mall.

Pat’s Jeff is a little quieter.

Every actor brings his or her or their own energy and own take.

And to me, the whole thing felt right.

I was on set watching Pat embody Jeff for the first time.

[Laughs] So I was like, “Okay, we’re in good hands.

This is a very, very skilled actor.

Then I became enthralled because his interpretation was so, I thought, compelling.

You’re right, there’s a kind of a vulnerability and a tentativeness that he brought.

Or so he thought.

But we meet Pat Healy’s version of Jeff when the tables have already turned.

So immediately he has reason to be unsettled and to be shaken.

His mother is played by… Carol Burnett, which is fun.

Carol is a hugeSaulfan.

Why was she ideal for this role?

We conceived of the role first in the room.

And often, one’s vulnerability is one’s loved ones.

And if he was living with his mom, then that character could be a mark for Gene.

And we were very lucky to get her.

Will we see her and/or Jeff again?

The word that we used a lot in the room to describe Marion was “independent.”

We didn’t want a shrinking violet.

This was even before we knew that we would for sure have Carol Burnett.

Or as somebody who was easy for Gene.

We always want him and all of the characters to have to work.

If it was too easy, it wouldn’t satisfy us as storytellers or satisfy the audience.

And it softens her to him.

And to me, it reads as very genuine at the end.

Speaking of casting, Jim O’Heir plays Frank, the mall security guard.

Are there a lot ofParks and Recreationfans atSaul?

How did he put in your orbit?

He was the man for the job.

And we were just incredibly fortunate to get him because he was incredible.

And they had crossed paths in Chicago as improvisers and just had such a great time together.

And we’re so lucky to have gotten him.

I’d be a ghost.

Less than a ghost, I’d be a shadow.

I’d just be nothing.

I mean, what’s the point?”

So it is truly both at the same time.

Two things can be true.

It’s not like he does this every day.

He does it under great duress in case of emergency.

It’s like his emergency ammunition.

Another potent scene is when Gene emphatically lays out to Jeff that they aredone.

I think you’re right.

But he puts it on the end of the rack.

Is it meaningful that he didn’t put it all the way back or just a cool shot?

I think it’s both.

In this case, it was in the script.

And so with longing in his eyes, he turns and walks away, but leaves the skin behind.

It’s bold that the whole episode is in black and white.

Will the Gene-era story remain in black and white?

And was there discussion about switching to color once you settled in this time period?

I love that the episode was all in black and white.

And that was just cool artistically.

So there was a real honoring of some film history as we delved into this one.

But in terms of moving forward, I can neither confirm nor deny.

What is your cryptic tease for next week’s episode?

We’re going to keep you on your toes.

And what adjective would describe that episode?